Iowa County WI Archives History .....Iowa Series 24, Case #?? Univ. Of Wisconsin At Platteville December 1896 ************************************************ Copyright. All rights reserved. http://www.usgwarchives.org/copyright.htm http://www.usgwarchives.org/wi/wifiles.htm ************************************************ File contributed for use in USGenWeb Archives by: Nancy Poquette npoq@hotmail.com October 10, 2006, 5:02 am Book Title: The Great Church Trial, GEORGE BUNTING, Defendant In the year 1896, the members of the Primitive Methodist Society of Dodgeville were considering whether to secede from the Primitive Methodist denomination and switch to a Congregationalist denomination. There appeared to have been about 150 full members of the P. M. denomination when the discussions began. The Rev. Titmarsh was the pastor of the P. M. Church at that time, but he was ready to convert to Congregational and was very persuasive to his congregation. At a meeting on December 28, 1896, the majority voted to convert to a Congregationalist Church. This majority appeared to consist of 110 to 130 members. The dissenting voters learned that it was reported to the Congregational delegates that the vote was unanimous in favor of the change, and 40 members went to the Congregational Council downstairs, to protest that the vote was not unanimous [see Thomas Arthur’s testimony]. In February of 1897, the majority ruled, and the change was put into effect, including, they thought, the ownership of the church property. However, the dissenters, which included Thomas Arthur and GEORGE BUNTING as trustees of the old Primitive Methodist Society disagreed, believing that since they were still members of the overall Primitive Methodist faith, that they were the caretakers of the church property for the Primitive Methodist Society and Conference. On three separate occasions, the stalwart remaining Primitive Methodists asked the Rev. Titmarsh to allow the members of the P.M. Society to meet on the church property to re-organize themselves with an election of replacement trustees, and so on. Rev. Titmarsh refused each time. Titmarsh also believed that the property belonged with the majority of the congregation, and so disregarded procedures for the transfer of deeds. Rev. Titmarsh’s Examination I live in the City of Dodgeville. I am a minister of the Gospel. I am in charge of the Plymouth Congregational Church. I have been in charge of that church since February 1897. They had held their meeting in the Plymouth Congregational Church preaching twice on Sunday, morning and evening; Tuesday night, Christian Endeavor, Wednesday night prayer meeting, Sunday school, Sunday afternoon, are the services held there. Up to the eighth of August, except during meetings the church was kept under lock and key. The janitor has one key, I have another. No one else has one to my knowledge. J. B. McPherson was the janitor. He is employed by the Plymouth Congregationalists and is a member of that church. Question? The windows were secured by ordinary catches, to prevent raising them from the outside. I was in the church on the Saturday night preceding the 8th day of August at half past nine o’clock. I could not say who closed the church that night. I do not know. It is customary to lock the door after people leave. I did not lock it. Question? I was there Sunday morning between six and seven o’clock. Mr. Prideaux and Mr. BUNTING, two of the defendants were there when I got there. I had a slight acquaintance with Mr. Prideaux previous to that time, but could not locate him until he told me his name. They were standing on the sidewalk opposite the church when I first saw them. I went up to the church door, tried to get in. I put the key in the door and found it would not unlock. I observed a ticket on the door, also a few bolts, the heads of the bolts outside. Question? This is the notice or one similar to it that was on the door, meaning notice handed him by council. Notice offered in evidence. Objected to, overruled. Question? I had some conversation with Mr. Prideaux and Mr. BUNTING. On Saturday evening two letters were left for me in the church to take with me on Sunday. I went to the church between six thirty and seven o’clock, but could not enter. Mr. Prideaux told me he had the church in his possession and was authorized to guard the same. He also told me he had the key. I asked him if he would permit me to go in. He said he would on condition that would come straight out again and not molest anything. On my return, he told me he was fully authorized to do what he was doing. I never saw anyone in the church when I was there. I observed that there was a new lock on the door. A piece of wood was screwed on the door and also on the floor. Another upright piece about four feet, six inches long to bar the door. I noticed no iron bars except the bolts on the lock, which were about four inches long., three eighths of an inch thick. Question? The earliest services to be held that morning was at nine o’clock. The changing of the locks and bolting of the doors was not ordered by me or the Plymouth Congregational Church. I did not notice whether either of the men there were armed or not. On coming out of the church, I spoke a few words to Mr. BUNTING and Mr. Prideaux. Mr. Prideaux locked the door and kept the key. I asked Mr. BUNTING if he was prepared to take the consequences of his actions and he said he was. Cross Examination Question? I said the members of the Congregational Church worshiped until February. I should have said December 1896. Up to that time, there were services conducted there by another denomination known as the Primitive Methodists. Up to December 1896, the Primitive Methodist worshipped in that church. Ever since I knew of that church and up to December 1896, it was known as the Primitive Methodist Church. This society belonged to a Primitive Methodist Conference. I would not say that it is incorporated. I have preached there for three years. I preached there as a Primitive Methodist until May last. There were services held in church by the Primitive Methodists up to December last. I do not claim that I preached as a Primitive Methodist preacher until December last. Question? I do not claim this. I was ____ ____ ___ ___ __ from December to May 1. I did not ___________________________ as a Primitive Methodist tell the people they should not believe what I advocated as a Primitive Methodist minister. I drew my salary until last May as a Primitive Methodist minister. Question? In January, 1897, I was chairman of a meeting called to satisfy three other places in connection to one. It was discussed then about electing delegates. Under rather peculiar circumstances they were elected. I presided at a meeting which chooses delegates to a Primitive Methodist Conference about that time. Later I went to the Primitive Methodist Conference myself and took part in the proceedings as a Primitive Methodist minister. Since May the 2nd, I have not preached as a Primitive Methodist minister. Up to that time I did. I am drawing a salary from Primitive Methodist congregations. I preach here as a Congregationalist. I do not change when I go into the country. Up to May last the members who claimed to belong to Primitive Methodist and Congregational congregations attended services. One told me he would be a Primitive Methodist while there was a plank left. I don’t know whether any of them spoke to me about this since May. Since December 1896, some of those who belong to the Primitive Methodist Church have spoken to me and told me they did not want to change. They have also requested me to call a meeting of the members of the Primitive Methodist Church to meet in that Church and I refused to do so. They have requested this on three different occasions since 1896. And I, each and every time refused to grant that request. The object for which those meetings were to be held was to fill vacancies of offices when there were none to fill. At that time ____ _____ _____ _____ ____ ____ ____ authority to call a meeting. There ____ no officers of the Primitive Methodist church in existence at this place. I was not mistaken when I spoke of officers a few minutes ago. Question-Do you mean to say that the congregation of the Primitive Methodist had no officers at that time? Answer-No sir. Question-Do I understand you to say that at the time the request was made of you to call a meeting of Primitive Methodists had no officers? Answer-The change in name had been made at that time. At the time I was requested to call a meeting of Primitive Methodists there were no officers of that church in the city. When I testified this morning that the Primitive Methodist Church offices were not vacant, I meant they were every one filled by the same men under a new name. Question-Did the officers of the Plymouth Congregational Church fill the offices of the Primitive Methodist Church up o the time of the change? Did the officers of the Congregational Church also fill the offices of the Primitive Methodist Church? Answer-I can’t answer it. The circuit steward of the Primitive Methodist handed me one or two notices to call a meeting. Question? I can’t answer whose property it was while I preached in it. I understood the church belonged to everybody in Dodgeville. We have more than two denominations here. I claimed the property belonged to the people of Dodgeville so far as I know. I couldn’t say how long the Primitive Methodists used that property. There was no deed or transfer been made to the Congregational Society that I know of. At the meeting over which I presided December 28, 1896, there was no committee appointed to try and obtain a deed from the Primitive Methodist Conference to the Congregational Church. At this meeting there was a committee appointed to ask the Primitive Methodist Conference to transfer the property to the Congregationalists. I may have appointed such a committee. It was not quite understood the attitude of the Conference toward then at that time. After the Congregational Society was formed and up to August 8th, 1897, I do not know what the members of the Primitive Methodist Church claimed. I know of a proposition for settlement through the papers. I have no recollection of a church meeting being called to consider it. I understand the officers had received a proposition from the Primitive Methodists. I understood for some time that some of the members of the Primitive Methodist Church claimed to own this property. On the morning of August 8th, I went into the church building for letters. Everything was not peaceable. I got my letters and went out again. There was war there. Question? There was no row there. I spoke to Mr. BUNTING when I came out. He did not seem to be angry with me. He was not in a peaceable mood. I did not ask him who he was angry with. I asked ____ if he was prepared to take the consequences ___ ___- ____ ___. I don’t know ___ ___ did anything or not. Question? After the Congregational Society was formed they worshipped in the same church. The Congregationalists believe they changed the lock. It was done to keep everybody out. Question? I couldn’t say whether anyone else except the Primitives tried to get in or not. I never saw anyone go in. It was done to keep everybody out. This includes all. Question? At the time the lock was changed, about the time the Primitive Methodists professed to want to hold a meeting there. I could not say whether there were guards there or not. The doors were locked. I was not there at any time since December last when the Primitive Methodists wanted to come in. The church is used by the Christian Endeavor Society. Those locks are in the church. I have access to them. The Primitive Methodist Sunday school is the same as when it was the Primitive Methodist Church. Question? I know the name has been changed, It went under the name of Primitive Methodist Sunday school up to the 8th of August. One teacher was a Primitive Methodist. I don’t know whether or not there were others. We call it now, Congregational Sunday school. At the time the name of the church was changed there were about 150 members of the Primitive Methodist. About 130 were resident members. Question? Frank Hocking had never been a member, nor Mr. Prideaux. Question? There is no difference between the creeds of the Primitive and Plymouth Congregational Churches. Each Congregational Church adopts its own creed. The one adopted by the Plymouth Congregational Church was the same as the one of the Primitive Methodists. There was no change introduced in the form of worship after the change. There was no change in the congregation nor in the minister. Question-What was the purpose of the change if there was no difference? Answer-People thought it would be better for the local church to do so. We made our own rules of government for the church. We adopted some of the Methodist Episcopal creed in our local government, and some of the Congregational Church, and all of the Primitive Methodist, excepting things which do not concern local churches. At the time we met to consider the proposition to change the church name, we had 130 resident members. Question? Answer-No member of the Primitive Methodist Church was excluded after the change. A resolution was passed giving the Primitive Methodists 30 days in which to join the Congregational Church, but it was afterwards rescinded at the same meeting. I couldn’t say how many former members of the Primitive Methodist Church refused to go under the name of the Plymouth Congregational Church, either 11 or 13. About 3 or 4 are male members. Question? I couldn’t say how many male members joined the Congregational Church. I think there were more than 25. In my opinion, there are more than 30. I am sure there were over 25. I am not sure that there were more than 30. Examination-Mr. Titmarsh (recalled) In answer to a question on cross examination yesterday in regard to adopting creed, I meant that as our form of government and policy we took part from Methodist Episcopal, Congregational and Primitive Methodist; but we did not change essentials at all. Question? I mean by creed, the doctrine of belief. I can’t say what difference between Methodist Episcopal and Primitive Methodist belief. I mean by belief the form of belief exception [acceptation?]. The fundamental doctrine in the Primitive Methodist is ____ ?ready ____ sa_e as of all Christian churches so far as I know. I know a little of church history. I know of some ___ ___ ____ ___ ___ believe in the spirit the same as the Primitive Methodist. ____ ___ ____ ___ ___ branch forms its own creed. All ___ ___ ____ ____ ____ ____ cost and resurrection. That is part of what I meant by creeds. The Congregational Church is independent, I believe, in its own rules and regulations. The Primitive Methodist church is governed by a conference consisting of a number of churches. That is one of the differences between the Primitive Methodist and Congregational church. Question? I have stated that the things I have named as fundamental beliefs are the same as those of the other. The doctrine of predestination is held by the Presbyterian Church. Other churches have fundamental doctrines not essential to Primitive Methodist or Congregational. The Baptists hold to the doctrine of baptism. Other churches believe in infant baptism. While most other Christian churches agree in the doctrines of Plymouth Congregational Church, they differ from it by engrafting other things with them. Baptism is not essential in all churches. Question? Primitive Methodist Churches believe in depravity. One of the fundamental differences between Congregational and Primitive Methodist church is that in the Congregational church each society or congregation is governed by itself, each being an independent church. And in the Primitive Methodist is what is known as an associated church being governed and ruled to a large extent by the conference to which the churches belong. Each Congregational Church is an independent church making its own rules and regulations for itself. Primitive Methodists have a conference who partly govern the churches. Question-The conference to which the Primitive Methodist of Dodgeville, of which you was its pastor, consisted of what territory? Answer-It consists of considerable territory, from Hazel Green to Lancaster and to Ridgeway. That is about as near as I can give it. I could not say how many churches belong to it. There are some in Illinois and one in Dane County. The mission in Iowa is dead. Question? Other conferences in the United States are the Eastern Conference and another, I think the Pennsylvania Conference. The Eastern Conference is not very large. The Pennsylvania Conference is somewhat larger than the Western Conference has been. The Primitive Methodist Church is about stationary at the present time. The outlook is not encouraging at all times. Question? Each Primitive Methodist calls its own minister but each minister is allowed to remain but 5 years. There are other matters of the church has control. Conference removes ministers when they have been at a place five years, and decides in regard to the creed. Primitive Methodists have called ministers not belonging to that denomination. Mineral Point has done so. Conference refused to recognize him two years ago because he was a Congregationalist minister, but still recognized and received the church, although he was its pastor. There is a General Conference but it has no controls over the Western Conference. I presume the Western Conference at sometime joined the General Conference, otherwise they could not have seceded. The Western Conference considered that it had withdrawn, but I do not know whether the General Conference accepted the withdrawal or not. Question? I do not know when the Primitive Church sent notice of withdrawal to General Conference. The question about sending minister to the General Conference came up at Ridgeway Conference and was thrown out. Question? I don’t know who prescribes the rules of the church when local conference does not belong to the General Conference. Examination-George Bartle I live in the city of Dodgeville. I am marshal. I was at the Plymouth Congregational Church on the 8th of August about 9 o’clock. I saw a big crowd of people there before I went up. They were between the courthouse yard and the church. I did not try the door. I stayed there until about 10:30 or 11 o’clock. The deputy sheriff asked to have the door opened. I saw Mr. BUNTING and Mr. Arthur and William Prideaux inside afterwards. Question? The window was raised on north and I saw them rush to the window. Mr. Mundy, the old gentleman, some one caught him by the feet and Mr. Prideaux struck him with a billy. I saw the billy afterward. I have it in my pocket. Mr., Prideaux had it at the time. He struck Mundy on the legs. As soon as I saw him hit Mr. Mundy I went in through the window. When I got inside Prideaux went to the front and Arthur to the back door. Arthur stopped McPherson from coming through the back door. I went to the front door after the back door had opened. Mr. Prideaux and Arthur stood by the front door, the former with this same billy. Mr. Mundy told me to arrest Prideaux for carrying a billy. I asked him what right he had to carry a billy, and he said for protection. He also said he had a gun. I asked him what right he had with it, and he handed me a revolver. It was nickel-plate, about 32 caliber. The deputy sheriff then took the revolver. Prideaux said he got it from Frank Hocking. Mr. Hocking was not present at the time. I told Prideaux I would take care of him, and he said ‘All right.’ There was a good deal of excitement before that time. The deputy sheriff had to command peace. I heard someone ask for a rope before the window was up. I don’t know what it was wanted for. I went back afterwards. In about 20 minutes Mr. Arthur was still against the door. Prideaux told me he wanted to see me. I did not stay there very long, maybe half an hour. I observed two marks as if the door had been pried open with a crowbar. It looked as if it were made recently. Question? I am the city marshal. I am a real marshal. I filed no bond with the city. Question? I went in through the window of the church building. I did not raise the window. There was a disturbance inside. Question? I heard no one yell for a rope. It looked like a riot inside. I did not see any disturbance whatever inside. Before this, some men tried to get in. I saw a crowd there. Question? I don’t know where Mr. Mundy was when they hollered for a rope. It was ten minutes after that I heard some one call for a rope. There was no trouble until the man struck Mundy with a billy. Question? I had no right to tell them to stay out. I noticed a crowd before I got down there. I then saw the crowd of people. The people outside did not appear to be much excited. Question? I don’t know whether the deputy sheriff had any papers. I heard him say nothing about it. Question? He tried to open the door by the latch. The door did not give. The people outside kept walking around the building. Question? I don’t know what they talked about. I don’t know that they called names or talked excitedly. I paid no attention. Question? I don’t know who asked for a rope. I asked no one what it was for. Those inside kept quiet as far as I know. I heard nothing from inside until after the window was opened. Mr. McPherson had a hold of the window outside when Mr. Arthur tried to shut it. Question? I don’t think my eyes were closed. I went there to prevent disturbance if any occurred. Question? I saw no one put a picket under the window to open it. I was on the north side where the window was opened. I went there to keep cool. Mundy went through that window. They tried to keep him out. Question? I suppose they must have. Those on the outside were not the aggressors. Those on the inside were trying to keep those on the outside out. I did not see anyone trying to get in before I saw Mundy go in. When I got inside, Prideaux went with me and offered me his gun. I saw the Arthur trying to stop them from coming in. I saw Arthur standing there. I did not see him do anything but hold the back door so that McPherson could not open it. Question? I did not see them take hold of each other. I heard Arthur tell McPherson not to open the door. McPherson went to the door first, then Mr. Arthur went there. Both had hold of the door. Arthur said ‘You can’t open that door.’ I don’t know whether he said, ‘Unless you have a right to’ or not. I don’t know what McPherson said to that. There was no row about it. I saw the defendants do nothing inside the church except to keep Mundy from going through that window. Question? I did not see the defendants do anything else, as I remember that would case a breach of the peace, not, no. Question? I don’t know what those people outside wanted the rope for. I did not try to find out. Question? I never saw J. J. Mundy open another window or the back door. I don’t know in which direction the back door was opened or who opened it. Question? I would not swear that either McPherson or Arthur opened the back door. I did not keep Prideaux very long. Question? Mr. Arthur asked me to let him go. I saw the city attorney and he told me that if Mr. Prideaux and Mr. Arthur gave me their word, I might let him go. Question? It was ten or fifteen minutes perhaps more, before the window was opened that I heard someone call for a rope. I searched Mr. Hocking and he had no arms. T. H. Arthur was there at the time the deputy spoke to me. I don’t think Arthur could hear what the deputy said to me. Examination of John Kelly I live in Dodgeville. I am a member of the Plymouth Congregational Church. I was a member of the Primitive Methodist Church. The change in name was made about February, of this year, I think. The matter was under general discussion among the members for a year previous. It had been talked of when Brother Hardcastle was here. He is now president of the Western Conference. I was present at the meeting at which it was decided to change to the Congregational Church. Notice of the meeting had been given for two weeks previous by the pastor at regular services. Time and place were given. I was a trustee of the Primitive Methodist Church. I am a trustee of Plymouth Congregational Church now. About 75 members attended that meeting. Question? I don’t remember how many voted. I think about 50 voted in favor of change and about 10 to 13 against. Some did not vote at all. The creed adopted was about the same as that of the Primitive Methodist. There was no change made in the belief that I know of. Question? I was in Dodgeville August 8th this year. Up to the time of the change in name, the Primitive Methodists were in possession of church property, after the change, the Plymouth Congregationalists. The same people and pastor worshipped there up until August 8th. I got to the church between 9 and 10 o’clock of the morning of 8th of August. I knew the door had been barricaded before going there. When I got there, there was quite a number of people there. The doors were barred and a notice on the front door. I did not see anyone inside at that time. I did not try to enter church. The usual hour for holding preaching service was 10:30 in the morning. Class meeting was to be held at 9 o’clock. People were not able to gain admittance to those meetings. I was there shortly after admittance was secured. There was quite a number in church. The back door was open, the front door was barred. It was locked and had a cleat nailed on the door, and another on the floor. I did not notice any brace. The back door had been secured in a similar manner. It was usually locked and had a slide bolt locking from the inside. Mr. Arthur and Mr. Prideaux, from the Point, and Mr. BUNTING were guarding this door. I remained there until nearly twelve o’clock. The front door was not then open. I returned about half past one. Things had not changed. Mr. BUNTING, I think, was acting as guard then. I had no conversation with these parties about their intentions. I saw Mr. Arthur and Mr. Hocking in the afternoon. They were upstairs with Mr. Bartle. I heard talk that Frank Hocking claimed to be a trustee of Primitive Methodist Church and as such claimed to be the owner. I saw Prideaux hand a revolver to the deputy sheriff. Prideaux also had a billy. Cross Examination I was a member of the Primitive Methodist Church about 20 years before. The people have built the church. It was caused to be erected I presume by members of the Primitive Methodist Church. Up to February 1897, these premises were used and occupied by the Primitive Methodists. I am not certain what year I became a member. In 1874 or 1875. The Primitive Methodists used and occupied those premises in question. The church building and premises were known up to that time as the Primitive Methodist premises. I know of no deed transferring church property to the Plymouth Congregational Church. I was a trustee of Primitive Methodist several years prior to February 1897. May have been 10 years. And since February 1897, I have been a trustee of the Plymouth Congregational Church. As such trustee, I have no knowledge that the Primitive Methodist Church ever executed any deed or other instrument transferring title to the Plymouth Congregational Church. Question? I intended to go to church, and did go to church on Sunday, August 8th. I got in between 11 and 12 o’clock. I am positive I got there between 11 and 12 o’clock. Question? I don’t know what time I got in. I would not say for sure what time I got in. I don’t think I got in at half past ten. I know I did not. After I got in, I saw Mr. Arthur, Mr. Prideaux and Mr. BUNTING. They were standing inside at the front door. They stood with their backs against the door. They were standing. I don’t know whether their backs touched the door or not. They were talking to some parties there. I was probably within 10 or 12 feet from them. I could not hear what they said. The crowd was quiet when I got there outside and inside. I saw none of the defendants cause any disturbance in there. Mr. Prideaux made no attempt to use his revolver to my knowledge. He handed it to the officer. He made no fuss about it. I did not see him use the billy. I did not see the defendants do anything out of the way. I heard Mr. Arthur say nothing about opening the door, if they had a legal right. I meant what I stated in the testimony, in chief, about guarding the door, that they stood there with their backs to it. Examination of John Glanville I live in the city of Dodgeville. I am a member of the Primitive Methodist Church of Dodgeville. I am acquainted with Mr. Arthur and Mr. BUNTING. Question-Have you attended any meeting at which Mr. Arthur, Mr. BUNTING and others were present at which it was discussed as to procuring possession of the Congregational Church? Witness refused to answer on grounds that it might incriminate himself. I know of no meeting at which Mr. Arthur, Mr. BUNTING and Rev. Hardcastle were present. I know Mr. O’Connor. I have seen Mr. Arthur, Mr. Hocking and Mr. BUNTING meeting several times. I could not tell when I last saw them. I remember the occurrence on the morning on the 8th of August. I don’t remember seeing them together Saturday, or Saturday night before. I don’t remember of any meeting between Mr. Arthur and others consulting together about taking possession. I had no proposition to make in the matter. Examination of Henry Prideaux, Jr. I have lived in Dodgeville since 1874. I was a member of the Primitive Methodist Church of Dodgeville. I joined about 22 years ago. I continued a member up to the time of the name change. I held the office of trustee at the time of the change. I did not remain a member of that church after the change. I went with the Plymouth Congregational faction. I am a trustee of the latter church. There were nine trustees of the Primitive Methodist Church. Their names were Johnson Glanville, William Mylroie, John Kelly, I think Gilbert Thomas, and I think, Mr. Letcher. I rather think Mr. Arthur was a trustee, but am not positive, and myself. The defendant Frank Hocking was not a trustee. He is a brother-in-law of mine. He was never a member of the church to my knowledge. After the change of name and up to August 8th, the Plymouth Congregationalists occupied the church. Same pastor and people so far as I know. No change in worship, that I know of. No difference in doctrines of faith that I know of. I was at Plymouth Congregational Church on Sunday, August 8th in the morning. I got there about 9 o’clock. Went there to attend class meeting. I tried to gain admission. I took hold of latch and found the door was barred. I also saw the notice. I remained around there about three quarters of an hour. The church doors were not open when I left. I was at the front door of the church, I think, when the parties got in. I saw folks going through the window. I saw no resistance from inside. I noticed a revolver with Prideaux after I got in. Cross Examination I was a member of the Primitive Methodist Church about 22 years. I was a member of the church at the time the building was erected by Primitive Methodists. Ever since I have been a member of that church, up to the time of change, the building was occupied by Primitive Methodists. I never heard question of ownership discussed until this affair took place. I was a trustee of the Primitive Methodist Church at different times. I am not positive whether I was a trustee 12 years or not. I may have been. Question-Did the Primitive Methodists occupy those premises as their property? Answer-I should judge they did. I have been a trustee of the Congregational Church since they elected trustees. In the Primitive Methodist Church, the trustees are the parties who hold the property for the church. The trustees of the Congregational Church, I should judge, have the custody and control of the property of the Congregational Church. As a trustee of the Congregational Church, I know of a transfer having been made at one time. I mean that the survivors of the old trustees gave a deed to the Plymouth Congregational Church. I am not positive when it was. It may have been in February. I think it was about February. I think Mr. Vincent and Benjamin Thomas signed the transfer. They were trustees when the church was first erected. I have reference to the trustees of the Republican Church. I refer to those as the surviving trustees who deeded the property to the Congregationalists. I don’t know whether or not Thomas was ever a member. I don’t recollect that he was. I know nothing about whether these men ever acted as trustees of any church. During my membership of 22 years in the Primitive Methodist Church, neither of these men acted as trustees of the Primitive Methodist Church. I do not know whether trustees of the Primitive Methodist Church ever received a deed from trustees of the Dodgeville Republican Church. I do not know how long the Primitive Methodist Church of Dodgeville exists. I think perhaps that the Primitive Methodists have occupied this property back to 1865. I do not know how long that church has existed. As far back as I remember anything about Dodgeville Primitive Methodist Church, I can recollect no change. I came to church about 9 o’clock on the morning of August 8th. I had heard the door was barred before going. I supposed I had a right to go there and did go. I tried the door and read the notice. I saw several of the brethren around there. I was a little excited. Others were excited a little. I stayed there about 3 quarters of an hour. Excitement did not increase. I walked down to the courthouse yard and talked about matters. Some thought we ought to break into the church. I told them that I thought perhaps that was what they would like to see, trouble between church people. I told them we were waiting for legal advice. I think after a short time, I went back to church and some of us still talked matters over as to what was best to do. After a while, I went to Central Depot. When I was there a second time, some appeared more excited. I heard remarks about getting in there. No threats were made about using violence to those inside that I know of. I can’t remember who mentioned about breaking in doors and windows. A great many spoke of getting in some way. I went to Central depot on account of this church business. Went back to church after some time. A good many people had gathered on the north side near the back end of the church. I heard no great noise. I stayed nearly in front of the church for awhile, and after awhile, I head someone saying they were getting in through the window. I don’t remember hearing anyone call for a rope. I got inside and saw Mr. Arthur and Mr. Prideaux and Mr. BUNTING. I heard Mr. Arthur speaking but don’t remember what he said. There was considerable excitement. Those who had come in were quite excited. I heard Mr. Letcher say several things. I don’t remember of his saying that he was enough to put anyone on his back. I did not hear Mundy say so, or say anything about who could handle him. The defendants were creating no disturbance that I could see. Prideaux stood at the north door, Arthur at the south door, BUNTING was sitting on the south side. Question? When the present church edifice was built, I don’t remember. It was some years ago. It was built by subscription of members and people of the city and surrounding country. Many outside chipped in. I think there was some insurance money from the old building also used in erecting the new building. The Primitive Methodist minister who was here when the church was built collected money from different stations to assist in the building of this church. I remember that Brother Hardcastle and another gentleman started on a trip somewhere to collect money to pay debt. There was very little collected. I think the trip was a failure. While Mr. Cape was here, I think most of the $1,500 debt was paid off. I remember of a jubilee after the burning. The mortgage on the place, I should judge, was executed by trustees of the Primitive Methodist Church. I may have signed the mortgage. Testimony of John F. Johns I have lived in Dodgeville all my life, 48 years. I was a member of the Primitive Methodist Church of Dodgeville. The trustees at the time of the change, I could not name. I was present at the meeting at which the change was made from Primitive Methodist to Congregational. There was no change made in the creed of the church. I was a member of the committee appointed to fix creed for the Congregational church. There was a committee appointed to fix the doctrine and they made no change to my knowledge. I was a member of that committee. I continued to attend the services after the change. I had attended almost three years before. There was no change in the form of church worship. From the time they made the change in December 1896 to the 8th of August, the Plymouth Congregationalists met in the same church. I was at the church Sunday, August 8th this year. Got there about nine o’clock. There was a number of people outside, a notice on the door and the door locked. The notice is the one produced here this morning. I saw no one inside. I remained there about one hour at that think, I think. There was no attempt made to enter the building while I was there. I could not say how many people were there. I did not see defendants there at that time. I left about 10 o’clock to see Mr. Temby who was to preach there that morning. I got back in about 15 minutes. Mr. Temby did not come then. He came a little before 10:30. He was to preach at 10:30 before the Plymouth Congregational body. The door was still barred when I got back. There was a good deal of talk there. They tried the latch. About the number who were, I could not tell, possibly 150. I heard no one demand possession. I remained there, I think, about a half an hour. They had not got into the church. I did not see anyone in the church at that time. I did not see any of the defendants around the church. I then went to the Central depot. I was away possibly half an hour. I returned to the church. I went back and took off that notice. While doing that I saw the city marshal and this man they call Prideaux. That is the defendant in this case. I saw them going from the church toward the jail. They had gotten into the church when I got back. I went inside the church then. Of the defendants, I saw Mr. BUNTING walking from the front door to the rear of the church. He said nothing. I saw Mr. Arthur standing against the front door acting as a brace, it seemed to me. I don’t know how long he remained there. I stayed until nearly 12. I did not see Frank Hocking there at that time. I did not notice the lock or bolts at that time. I did not see the brace against the door. I saw a brace inside the little anteroom. This brace was a piece of wood. Cleats were fixed so as to hold the brace against the door. There was no such arrangement there previous to that time. I came back after dinner. Mr. BUNTING then sat by the door which was still locked. He stayed until Sunday school opened at two o’clock and soon afterward went upstairs. Cross Examination I stated that I had lived there all of my life. I belonged to the Methodist Episcopal Church at one time. I left that church and joined the Primitive Methodist Church. I got in no row there. I got an honorable discharge before I joined the Primitive Methodist Church. I did not conclude to change my creed at the time of changing from the Primitive Methodist Church to the Congregationalists. I went with the majority from Primitive Methodist to Congregational Church, and am not Primitive Methodist now. There was no change made in the creed that I know of. I am satisfied that there was not. I don’t think Mr. Titmarsh understood the question about changing creed. The rules and regulations of the Plymouth Congregational Church were not written by Mr. Titmarsh that I know of. The secretary did the writing for the committee, Mr. McPherson. I can’t say about the writing, Mr. Titmarsh may have written them. I went to the church about 9 o’clock on that Sunday morning. There were others there, members of the Congregational Church. There was considerable talking. They did not appear to be angry, no fuss or danger. I didn’t hear anyone call for the door to be opened. I did not ask to have it opened. I did not ask who was inside. I stayed there about an hour at that time. I then went to Mr. Temby’s. He is a Methodist Episcopal minister. He did not come up with me. I went back alone. The people around the church were a little more excited at that time, the boys of the city were excited. I could not say whether they wanted to worship there nor not. They were not churchgoers, not all of them. I stayed there for some little time, until after the ten thirty bell rang. I went to see if I could make some arrangements about getting into Sunday school. I wanted some advice. I went to the assistant superintendent, D. H. Williams. I talked with others. I could not say how long I was gone. I saw Williams at or near Central depot. He wanted to telephone to Mr. Smelker, a lawyer. We got no advice, and I went back to the church and took off the notice. I saw the marshal and Prideaux on the sidewalk going toward the jail. That was the first time I saw of Prideaux. When I got the notice, I went around to the back door, which I found open. I saw quite a number inside. I saw Arthur and BUNTING. They said nothing at that time to cause a disturbance. F. P. Hocking said he guessed I had better let the door alone. That was after school. When I got into the church the defendants were pretty quiet. I don’t know as I asked him why I had better not open the door. I don’t recollect of his saying anything else. He was 12 or 14 feet from me at the time. I said if I had a wrench, I would unscrew these bolts. I don’t know whether he replied or not. I asked him if he had a wrench. I don’t know what he said. He behaved himself as far as I know. Question? I supposed that piece of iron came from the lock. I could not see the place from where it was broken. I will not swear that it came from the other lock. I found that piece of iron about five o’clock. I did not travel over that place before. A good many people, probably 100 or more had been in church that day before I found that iron. Testimony of J. B. McPherson I live in the city of Dodgeville. I am janitor of the Plymouth Congregational Church. I was there on the 8th of August of this year. I tried to enter the church. I got there somewhere between 15 and 20 minutes after 8 o’clock. I tried to enter the church. I tried to unlock the door, but could not do so. Question? Some key that had previously unlocked the door. It would not fit that morning. I noticed there was a notice on the door. The door was bruised as if a bar had been used to pry the door open. There were no such marks on the day before. I noticed bolts through both doors that were not there before. It is a double door, two bolts in each half about 3 or 4 inches apart. I did not measure it. I got inside afterwards. The last of the defendants left the church about 5 o’clock. Don’t know who was last. There were none of them there after supper. The front door was open then. The burrs had been taken off two of the bolts and the catch had been taken off. I knew nothing exactly about where that lock came from. I took it off the church door the Monday or Tuesday after the disturbance. I first saw it on the church door on the 8th of August. It is not the same lock that had been there before. It had been put on during the night of August 7th. It was fastened with two screws and two bolts going through the door. The catch was fastened by bolts going through the door. There was a cleat screwed on the door and another on the floor. They were wooden cleats. There were screws put in behind one door at the top and bottom. There was a cleat and brace at the back door. It had been put on since Saturday night before. I was there when the window was first opened to go in. I think Mr. Mundy entered first. T. H. Arthur and Mr. BUNTING and Prideaux were inside. They had been inside previous to the opening of the window. There was a scuffle when Mundy was going in. All defendants had a hand in it. I saw Mr. Prideaux with a billy in his hand. I saw him do nothing with it. I saw no other arms but the revolver. I saw no other fastenings. Cross Examination I helped to open the window on the north side. I could not tell who helped me. Mundy did not help me. I was excited. I can’t remember who helped me. Arthur tried to keep the window down on the inside. I heard someone on the outside talk of breaking in. I may have heard something about throwing those on inside out. I saw somebody put a picket under the window, might have been Fred Kessler. Those inside were quiet. I heard someone call for a rope. I heard nothing about hanging. I don’t know who asked for a rope. No rope was brought. Question? I could not say that I heard W.J. DAVEY [William John Davey, son of John Dyer Davey, Jr] say ‘Bring me a rope.’ Others rushed in with Mundy. The defendants did nothing. They were quiet. Prideaux took the revolver and handed it to the officer. The officer would not take it and then he handed it to the deputy sheriff, who took it. Prideaux did not appear angry. He didn’t appear worried. I tried the latch of the back door after I got in. Mr. Arthur told me not to open unless I had a right to. I don’t remember what I told him. I did not think there was much difference in our rights there. After he took hold of the bar, I left it alone. I then started toward the front door to open it, and Mr. Arthur told me to let it alone, and I did so. Mr. Arthur used words to the effect that if the deputy sheriff or anyone having a right to open that door, could do so. I was there in the afternoon. I did not hear Mylroie or his son say that Arthur ought to be tarred and feathered. I understood that Mr. Mylroie had made such a remark. There was no iron plate over the lock that I know of. There was a wrought-iron catch. McPherson Re-called I testified this morning that I was janitor of the Congregational Church. The Plymouth Congregational put a new lock on the door. I could not say what it was put on for. Question? March 29th or 30th. I remember the Primitive Methodists members wanted to hold a meeting in that church. I don’t think they were allowed to get in, although they tried. I did not forbid them to go in. I do not think I told them they should not go in. Johns and I were not there to guard the door. We went to the door to see if they had broken in. I don’t know what Johns said to me, nor I to him. I had not been advised to let anyone in there. We had no orders to keep anybody out on Sabbath days. There may have been something said to our society about not letting the Primitive Methodists in. I don’t know whether we had an understanding to keep them out or not. Examination of John J. Mundy I was at Plymouth Congregational Church the 8th of August, this year. I did not take charge of defendant Prideaux. The marshal took him. He produced a revolver. Either the marshal or myself asked him his authority for carrying weapons and he handed me the revolver. He made a statement later, on the 9th or 10th of August that he got it from Frank Hocking, and told me to return it to him. I asked Mr. Arthur if he had any weapons. He said he had a screwdriver. I felt a revolver in his pocket and he said he had a right to carry it; he was a peace officer. It was in his right hip pocket. I felt around in his right hip pocket. I think I felt a revolver. I might have considered any hard thing a revolver. I was excited. I asked him if he had a revolver and he said, ‘I have a screw driver.’ He said he had a revolver and he had a right to carry it. I may have been mistaken. I would doubt it if he had told me he had not one. I saw no revolver about him. I think I would swear to it. I had my hand on the revolver for about half a minute. I think I could have counted to 30 while I had my hand there. I thought he might have a right to carry it after he told me he had a right to carry a revolver. I came away from him. He did not take it out. I was there from 8:45 to ten, excepting a half an hour. I came back later on. I am the son of William Mundy, who has testified. I am undersheriff. I demanded that the door be opened as undersheriff. I had no papers and had no authority any more than the others. There was no great excitement. There was excitement on the part of the crowd who came in from the outside. I did not urge people to get in. I heard nothing about a rope. I heard about breaking in doors, and told them to keep quiet. I said if they gave me authority, I would break doors open. (I meant official authority). I stopped the noise without being requested. I was asked by Mr. Arthur later to keep them quiet. I saw no fight in the afternoon between two men there. I heard no one say, ‘If you don’t keep away I will hit you.’ Prideaux made no resistance when asked for the revolver. He offered it to me twice before I took it. The marshal arrested him and asked my assistance and I walked a short distance with him and back. As far as I noticed, the defendants did not break the peace except guarding the door. The worst, outside of that, was when BUNTING said ‘Put me out.’ I did not hear any say ‘Throw them out.’ Before the people outside got in, there was no noise. The disturbance was made by those coming in from the outside. I heard Mr. Arthur talk a little loud at one time. There was no threatening; some obscene language. He called a young boy there a dirty little snot. I don’t know what he said it for. That was about the time Mylroie said Arthur ought to be tarred and feathered. That was the dirtiest language I heard. I heard none of the defendants use bad language. I was there in the afternoon. I think JOE DAVEY swore [Joe Thomas Davey was married to George Bunting’s granddaughter, Ida Belle Tyrer]. I think you might term it swearing. I don’t know whether he is a trustee or not. Examination of Mr. William Mundy I live in the city of Dodgeville. I have lived here about 43 years. I was a member of the Primitive Methodist Church about 35 years. I held no office at the time of the change. I was not present at the meeting at which the change was made. I worshipped in Plymouth Congregational Church the same as before. I have attended Plymouth Congregational services. I have not attended business meetings. I was present at church on the 8th day of August. I got there about 10 minutes before 9 in the morning. I went to attend class meeting. I was there when an entrance was effected through the window. I can’t say who entered first. Two boys, I think got in first. I was the first man. When I was getting into the window, some one grabbed me by the legs. I think Mr. Arthur and Prideaux struck me with a billy. He struck me on the legs. I couldn’t say how many times he struck me. It was more than twice. I consider myself a member of the Congregational Church. I subscribed to the rules of the Primitive Methodist Church and was a regular member. I told them I was willing to go with the majority. I would have remained with the majority had the change not taken place. I was a member of the Primitive Methodist Church 35 years, during which time they used and occupied these premises. I presume the Primitive Methodists claimed to be owner of that property during that time. The Primitive used and occupied the same premises before I joined. They have used that property for church purposes for 43 years. I helped as a member of that congregation to help rebuild the burned church. I again assisted in rebuilding the church in 1880 as a member of that congregation. Until the Congregational Church was organized, that property was known as Primitive Methodist Church property. After February 1897, I presume the Primitive Methodist Sunday school was conducted in that building. I don’t know whether Primitive Christian Endeavor occupied the building or not. I arrived at the scene of action about 9 on August 8th. I did not hear the doors were locked before going there. I did not feel pleasant when I learned the doors were close. I got very angry later on in the day. Before making an entry into the building, I made no threats to break in. I advised to starve them out. It could be done quietly. They did not follow my advice, nor did I follow it myself. I do not think I said ‘The first one coming through the window ought to be shot’. I did not say ‘I could put any man on his back’. I said later on that I would take that Prideaux man, and whale him. I may have said I could tear him limb for limb. I thought Prideaux was pointing the revolver at my son at first, but learned I was mistaken later. I don’t know who raised the window. Some one said it was raised, and I was the first man that got in. I was determined to get inside the first chance I got. I did not propose to use any force. I did not allow them to push me out again. When I was only partly in I would not allow them to put me out if I could help it. My head and shoulders were outside the window and my legs inside. My legs were not pushed back at all. I think Mr. Arthur tried to put me out. No one shoved me from the outside. Prideaux struck me with the billy on different parts of my legs. He left no marks and did not hurt me much. He struck me on the side of the shins. I noticed no marks. Arthur had hold of my legs below the knees. I could feel him but not see him. Prideaux was punching me with the billy. He struck both ways. They let body and limbs alone after I got on the floor. After I got inside, I did not see defendants do anything. I mean that they laid no hands on me, or anyone else. I heard them make no noise. I heard BUNTING say, ‘Put me out.’ The officers, I suppose, had to interfere to keep the crowd who had come in, quiet. I did not hear the crowd say anything about putting those inside out. BUNTING was inside when he said, ‘Put me out.’ I never heard anything about throwing anyone out. I did not open the front door. I stopped because I could not go farther. The door was bolted. I did not yell, ‘Who is a match for me?’ I was impartial up to this time. I don’t know as I have taken sides. I am a full-fledged Congregationalist. Perhaps my son told me to keep still. Examination of Mrs. Clara Waddington My name is Mrs. Clara Waddington. I live just across the street from the church we have been talking about. I was at home the night before the 8th of August. I heard no unusual noise or disturbance at the church at night, but did early in the morning. About five o’clock. I heard these men that have been spoken of. I heard Mr. Prideaux. I saw Mr. Johnson Glanville try the door and call Frank. He then went around the back of the church and was gone a few minutes. He returned and tried the door again, but did not get in. A short time afterward I saw this man, Mr. Prideaux walking back and forth in front of the church. Mr. BUNTING also came along pretty soon. Mr. Titmarsh came and inquired if the church was locked and after some conversation he was allowed to go in, I think by Mr. Prideaux. The first noise I heard was about five o’clock. Cross Examination I live right across the street from the church. I was in the house in a room upstairs in the southwest corner at five o’clock. It was daylight. I don’t know how wide the street is. My house is back about 16 feet from the live. My house is a corner house. I saw Glanville come to the church early in the morning. I presume he came to worship. He could not come in. He called Frank and shook the door again. He then went around to the back door. I don’t know whether he touched the back door or not. Examination of G. W. Holmes I live at Mineral Point. I am City Marshal. I know the defendant Frank Hocking. I saw him on August the 7th this year at Mineral Point. I had some conversation with him about hiring someone to take care of a church out here. He asked me if I knew anyone who wanted a job for a few days and I told him of Mr. Prideaux, and we drove there. I don’t know that he mentioned the name of any church. He got Mr. Prideaux. I heard part of the conversation between them. He asked Mr. Prideaux if he wanted to make a couple of dollars a day to sit down and smoke and he said he did. I heard no more of it. Examination of J. H. Ford I live in the city of Dodgeville, I am a hardware dealer. I know the defendant T. H. Arthur. I don’t recollect whether he was in my place on the 7th or not. Could not say, within a week. I sold him a lock for a door shortly before this occurrence, I think about the first of the month. I don’t know whether this is the lock or not. From all appearance it was like this. Cross Examination I can’t tell whether this lock came out of my store at all or not. Examination of J. H. Wallis I am Sheriff of Iowa County. I was in the Dodgeville city on the 8th day of August this year. I left the city about 9 o’clock in the morning. I was at Plymouth Congregational Church between six and 7:30 in the morning. Mr. William Prideaux and Mr. GEORGE BUNTING, two of the defendants were there, standing just outside the church door, the east door of the church. I had known Mr. Prideaux for many years. He resides in the city of Mineral Point. He had not been stopping here before the time to my knowledge. I noticed a notice on the church door. As I came by, I noticed Mr. Prideaux and spoke to him. We shook hands. I remarked to him he was up pretty early. He told me he had been up all night. I asked him what was the trouble and he stated he had this church (motioning to the Plymouth Congregational Church) and said he was guarding it. His exact language was ‘I have this church on my hands and am here guarding it.’ I told him I thought he had quite a load on his hands. I asked him what this notice was that was on the door. He informed me that he did not know what the notice contained, that he had not read it. I then went up and read the notice on the door. I then went on about my business. The notice was a printed notice, looked as if it was typewritten. I didn’t notice anything about the barring of the door at that time, but I did later on. I did not see Mr. Hocking or Mr. Arthur at the church. I saw Mr. Arthur just across the street in front of the church. He was walking north on the opposite side of the street. I was there again about nine o’clock. There were quite a number of the members of the Congregational Church. I observed the heads of what appeared to be four bolts through the door. I was in my carriage in the street at that time. I had been to the church frequently prior to that time and had never noticed those bolt heads there. Cross Examination I am a member of the Congregational Church. I had been a Primitive Methodist for about 30 years, but have changed to the Congregational Church. I did not belong to the Dodgeville Primitive Methodist Church. I have been a Congregational since about February. I joined on coming here from Mineral Point. I had not lived here last fall, and never was a Primitive Methodist here. I don’t know who this church building was put up by. I think it was known as the Primitive Methodist Church until sometime in 1896. I do not know whether all the Primitive Methodists changed to Congregational or not. I joined the Plymouth Congregational Church in this city some time in the spring, I think in February. They were worshipping in the building on the door of which I saw this notice and these people. They continued to meet there until the 8th day of August so far as I know. They held services there regularly each Sunday. From the time I came there up to the present time, no other denomination has held meetings there to my knowledge. The pastor was not a Primitive Methodist up to this spring so far as I know. I don’t know whether he drew his salary as a Primitive Methodist minister up to last May or not. The same minister preaches in the Congregational Church now, who has preached for some time in the Primitive Methodist Church. I don’t know that he is now preaching in two Primitive Methodist Churches. I don’t know that he has two Primitive Methodist appointments in the country now. I heard that he began to preach as a Congregational last fall or winter. I know or have heard of only three men in the city who now claim to hold possession of the church as Primitive Methodists. Two of them are defendants in this case. I don’t know whether the bolts held the lock to the door or not, but it seemed so. Examination of R. J. Reckenthaler I live in the city of Dodgeville. I have a blacksmith shop here. I know T. H. Arthur. He was in my shop some time probably before the 8th of August. I saw him cut something from a plate of iron, a short time before the 8th of August. The plate did not look anything like this. I don’t know what size it was. I made a piece that looked like this for Frank Hocking. I could not tell when I made it. I have no idea how long before the 8th of August it was. Cross Examination I don’t know whether this is the piece or not. It looks just like it. Direct Examination The date on which I made this clasp for Frank Hocking was July 28th, 1897. Examination of Robert Mathews I live in Mineral Point city. I am an iron molder. I am acquainted with Frank Hocking. I saw him on Saturday, August 7th of this year at my home in Mineral Point. It was between 12:30 a 1 o’clock. He came to the door while I was eating dinner. He asked me if anyone was in the adjoining room and I said there was. He asked me to step out on the front steps. He asked me if I wanted a good, easy job. I told him I had a job. I asked him what the job was, and he said to sit down and take it easy watching a church. I told him I did not think I could take the job, and told him I expected to go to work Monday morning. He asked me if I knew anyone who wanted a job and I told him possibly Marshal Holmes could tell him. He asked me where he could find him, and I told him either at Mulhaern’s cigar store or home at dinner. He then drove off in his buggy. I don’t remember whether he stated what church it was or not. He said part of the congregation had turned Congregationalists and they wanted to take hold of the property. Cross Examination He asked me if I wanted a good, easy job. Examination of Rev. John Hardcastle I live at Platteville. I am a Primitive Methodist minister. I was in Dodgeville prior to August 7th of this year, some weeks, five or six ago. James L. O’Connor was not here to my knowledge. I met some of the Primitive Methodists here and talked the matter over. I met T. H. Arthur, F. P. Hocking, GEORGE BUNTING. We were not together at once. There was no plan mentioned at that time about securing possession of the Primitive Methodist Church in the nighttime. State of Wisconsin Circuit Court of Iowa County Alice Cape, et al, plaintiffs Vs Plymouth Congregational Church, et al. Deposition of Thomas H. Arthur “Deposition of Thomas H. Arthur, a witness, taken before me at my office in the city of Dodgeville, in said county and state on the 21st day of September, 1903, commencing at 10 o’clock am. Pursuant to the annexed notice, to be used on the part of the defendants in an action pending in the Circuit Court for Iowa County, in the state of Wisconsin, wherein Alice Cape, et al, are plaintiffs and Plymouth Congregational Church, et al are the defendants. The said witness being first duly sworn by me to testify the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth relative to said action, in answer to oral interrogatories propounded by J. P. Smelker, Esq. who appeared for the defendants (the said deponent being represented by his attorney, C. Spensley, esq.) deposed and made answer as follows: My name is Thomas H. Arthur. I am in my 54th year. I am now at Ridgeway. Lived there since April 1899. I am engaged in business there. I became a member of the Primitive Methodist Church 25 or more years ago. I have never severed my connection with that church. There is a Primitive Methodist Church at Ridgeway and has been for many years. I was circuit steward, chorister and organist, superintendent of the Sabbath School and trustee at different times, and chairman of the Finance Committee of the d. Primitive Methodist Society. Question-When were you last steward before the church withdrew from the Conference? Answer-I have been Circuit Steward continuously since 1894 until now. I was Chorister of the church until 1895 or 1896. I am not positive. I think I was last Superintendent of the Sabbath School in the spring of 1896. I might have been in 1895. Question-When were you last Trustee before the church withdrew from the Conference? Answer-If I remember correctly, I have been trustee continuously from the spring of 1890 until now. Question-When were you last elected trustee before the church withdrew from the Conference? Answer-I cannot answer that. We elected trustees for three years, and when I came back from Cobb in 1890, I cannot tell whether I was elected to fill a vacancy or not, or for the three years. When my term expired, I was re-elected. As my term expired, I was re-elected. If I remember rightly, I was last elected trustee at a meeting at Brother Glanville’s house in this city. I will correct that by saying that I was elected there, but the last election was at the City Hall. The election at the City Hall was either in 1900 or 1901. Don’t remember who were at the meeting. I came in from Ridgeway to attend the meeting. Question-Give me the names of those who were there. Answer-I have attended a number of those meetings at the City Hall, and it is almost impossible for me to separate each individual meeting and tell who was there at each meeting. Question-Is it not a fact that the same persons attended all of these meetings? Answer-Some might have been present at all of the meetings, some might have been present at one and some at another. I can’t say as to that. Question-Can you tell me the names of any one who was present at the City Hall when you were last elected trustee? Answer-I cannot tell. Question-When was the meeting held at the house of Johnson Glanville? Answer-1897 or 1898, I am not sure which. It was in the summer or fall. I cannot recall the month. The meeting was held in the afternoon and evening, but I don’t know whether I was elected in the afternoon or evening. The afternoon and evening meetings were not held the same day. The evening meeting was held first. Brother Johnson Glanville was present, and I think Brother BUNTING and Mrs. Chappel and Miss Annie Glanville, and I think Mrs. Theobald and her daughter, Annie Simpson, and Nellie Freeman, and Dick Kolwinski and Frank Hocking and Mrs. Sarah Brown were there, and others were there. The room was filled. I don’t recall the names of any others who were present at the evening meeting. That evening meeting was pursuant to notice, given the Sunday previous, to the best of my recollection. It was either given the Sunday previous or a week from that Sunday. The notice was in writing. I do not know where that notice is. I am not positive whether it was signed or not. I read the notice. I think there was a record of the notice. I do not know where it is. I don’t keep the records, Miss Nellie Freeman is the Secretary. Mrs. Sarah Chappel was the Secretary at that time. Ido not know when she was elected. Question-What was the object of the meeting as expressed in the notice? Answer-The transaction of general business. I don’t think there was anything else. I think the notice read that the meeting would be held for such business as would come before it. Meetings of this character had been called that way for upwards of 30 years. The announcement was made immediately after the Sunday morning services, before the people retired. I announced it. I don’t recall the day of the month. I think the notice was given in February or March. Question-Was this notice given before or after the incorporation of the Plymouth Congregational Church? Answer-It was before I knew anything about the incorporation of the Plymouth Congregational Church. Question-Who was conducting the services at the Plymouth Congregational Church on that Sunday? Answer-There was no Plymouth Congregational Church at that time. Rev. Titmarsh, pastor of the Primitive Methodist Church of the Dodgeville Circuit was conducting the services. I think Brothers BUNTING, Prideaux and Glanville, and the usual Sunday morning congregation was there. From 125 to 150 was the usual Sunday morning congregation. Question-When you gave this notice, had a majority of the members of the Dodgeville Primitive Methodist Society voted to withdraw from the Conference? Answer-A majority of the society never did vote to withdraw from the Conference. I was consulted before this action was commenced. I talked with Mr. Mason, Mr. Carter, and Mr. Reese before the action was commenced. I have never seen the complaint. I did not consult with the parties as to what the complaint was to contain. I do not know from whom the attorneys got their information upon which to base their complaint. Question-Did you give the attorneys any information upon which to base their complaint? Answer-I have talked to them a number of times about it. I don’t know whether they considered they got any information or not. Question-Had there been any vote taken by the Dodgeville Primitive Methodist Society on the question of withdrawal from the Conference before you read this notice in the church? Answer-I think there had. A majority of the votes that were counted, were said to be in favor of withdrawing; but the society went on with its usual routine for some months. After the notice was read, they took another vote. It was taken at a meeting in the Primitive Methodist Church. There was a large representation of the Society present. It was held the day that the Congregational Council was held here to consider the question of receiving the Dodgeville Church into that body. There was said to have been a majority in favor of withdrawing, but not near so large as on the former vote. I was present at that meeting. I think Judge Jenks was not there. McPherson, Johns, Mrs. Theobald, Bunting, and Glanville and a good representation of the Society was there. I think I had been a regular at the Sunday services for some time previous to the time this vote was taken. I think a notice of the first meeting, upon which a vote was taken, was given. It was the usual custom to read the notice but only once. I think notice was given in the same way, of the second vote. I have no positive knowledge of what took place at that meeting. After the second meeting, nearly 40 of us went downstairs to protest against the action of the Society, and against the church being received into the Congregational Body, because the Council had been informed that it was unanimous, and we wanted them to know it was not. I do not know that 40 went down, but we represented forty or more. I am not positive whether the Primitive Methodist Society of Dodgeville was ever incorporated. I have no papers to show it. I have no books belonging to the Primitive Methodist Society in my possession. I did not take any away with me, when I went away. I don’t know who may have the old books of the Primitive Methodist Church. There was no record book of the society meetings. The records were kept on little slips of papers and afterwards, lost or destroyed. There was a membership book and a book for record of the trustee meetings. That was rarely used. Only three or four times, to my recollection. I have not seen the membership book since 1896, I think. I have some papers with me belonging to the Society, whether they are important or not, I do not know. The witness here produced the papers and one was introduced in evidence and marked Exhibit ‘A’, a copy of which is hereto attached to this deposition. Question- What are the religious tenets of the Primitive Methodist Society of Dodgeville? Answer-They believe in the purity of Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden, in the fall of Man, in the Trinity, in the conviction of sin, and the Regeneration, adoption and sanctification. That is all I recall on the spur of the moment. Question-In what respects do these religious tenets differ from those of the Dodgeville Plymouth Congregational Church? Answer-I have not seen their articles of faith, if they have any, and can only judge of their beliefs by what some of the most active for the change said. Question-have you taken any pains to find out what the religious tenets of the Dodgeville Plymouth Congregational Church are? Answer-I have, both before and after the change. I asked those most active for the change, what was their creed since the change. I have inquired of a number of them whether they had adopted a creed. I have never asked the Secretary or any officer of the Society for a copy of their doctrines. I have sent a messenger to get one. That was Mrs. Sarah Chappel. I did not get a copy. I don’t know whether the religious tenets of the Dodgeville Plymouth Congregational Church are any different from the religious tenets of the Primitive Methodist Society or not. I think I heard Titmarsh preach once or twice after the Plymouth Congregational Church was received into the Congregational Body. I attended the Sabbath School regularly until August 1897. That had not changed. Answer-Why did you remain away from the services of the Plymouth Congregational Church? Answer-Because the minister took me by the collar and said, ‘If I was not a Congregationalist, I had no business there.’ That was Rev. Titmarsh. There was considerable feeling there, and I could see there would be strife and confusion, and I preferred to stay away rather than have strife and confusion. I might add to that, that I did not believe in their practices. Question-In what particular? Answer-It did not seem to make any difference to them who they received into the Church. I don’t apply these remarks to any individuals, but in the actions of the leaders of the Church. Those who receive the members into the church. Question-To what actions of theirs did you object? Answer-To their receiving members into the church without any profession of faith. Question-What was the only Rule of Faith and Practice in the Primitive Methodist Society of Dodgeville? Answer-There were two, I think. A person desiring to flee the wrath to come was admitted on probation. That probation continued from three to six months, as the case might be, then, upon public confession of a saving faith in Christ, they were admitted into full membership. Except that, I think a person must be of the age of sixteen. That is my impression. They also admitted persons to full membership by letter from other churches. If a letter was lost, they were admitted by producing evidence of membership and a public confession of faith. Question-Is it not a fact that the Dodgeville Primitive Methodist Church recognized the Word of God as the only rule of faith and practice? Answer-I think their creed is based on that Word. The Dodgeville Primitive Methodist Society did not have any different creed from any other Primitive Methodist Society. All the same. The conference formulated the creeds. I can’t say whether this rule of Faith and Practice which was just mentioned, is in the Discipline or not. Question-Are Primitive Methodist Churches bound by the creed as formulated by the Conference? Answer-As I understand it, they are. If they don’t like it, they must send delegates to the Conference to change it. If a church does not like the creed under certain conditions, the church might possibly withdraw from the conference. Question-What are those conditions? Answer-A Conference deals with circuits. If all the churches on a circuit unanimously vote to withdraw from a Conference, I presume they might do so, unless there was some legal barrier. Question-Where do you find any such Rule, as that which you have spoken of? Answer-I think you will find it in the action of the Conference in this very case. When the matter of the withdrawal was brought to the attention of the conference, a report was made and adopted, stating in substance this: That we find three of the charges of the Dodgeville Circuit have not withdrawn, and there is still a society in the fourth. I think that report was adopted at the Conference held at Ridgeway, in 1897. (The witness was here asked if the report found on page 15 of the printed report of the conference held at Ridgeway, Wis, in 1897 was the report to which he referred and he said it was.) Question-In that report, on page 15, is this language found, ‘Regarding the matter of the withdrawal of the Dodgeville, we think it a matter for the Conference to decide.’ Answer-It no doubt, appears there. I think the word ‘decide’ was not in the original report, but the words, ‘Deal with’ were there instead. I think the Committee was G. W. Watson, J. D. Blenkensop and W. D. James. Question-did the Conference at Ridgeway do anything about the withdrawal of the Dodgeville Society? Answer-By their actions, they said that the Dodgeville Church had not withdrawn. They seated the delegate from Dodgeville, Mr. Johnson Glanville. Their report says, that the delegates were elected by the Dodgeville Circuit. The report of the Committee was first laid on the table and afterwards taken up and passed. Question-On page 9 of the printed proceedings of 1897, I read this: ‘Report of Committee on Complaints and appeals was read.’ Is that the same report about which you have been testifying? Answer-I rather think that is the same report. Question-Was this action then taken by the Conference: ‘Moved by Brother G. Fox that the report be accepted and adopted.’ Moved to amend by Rev. T. Kent, ‘That the report be received and laid on the table.’ ‘Motion to amend prevailed.’ Answer-I think that was done. Question-Have not the Dodgeville Primitive Methodist Society and other Primitive Methodist Societies always claimed that it was their right to adopt such rules and regulations relative to Church policy as they might think proper, being responsible alone to the great Head of the Church, for the exercise of that right? Answer-No sir. Question-What is the Great Head of the Church? Answer-It is inferred in the previous question, it is God. Question-Are the religious beliefs of the Dodgeville Primitive Methodist Society different from the religious tenets to which you have referred? Answer-The beliefs and tenets are the same thing, practically. Question-What do you mean in your complaint by the organization of the Dodgeville Plymouth Congregational Church? Answer-As I have not read the complaint, I would refer you to my attorneys. Question-In what does the organization of the Primitive Methodist Church differ from the organization of the Plymouth Congregational Church? Answer-The Primitive Methodist Society is a unit-a part of the whole. The Congregational is the sum of the total-the whole thing. Question-Was the form of the Church government at the time of the apostles, Congregational? Answer-I should judge it was, for it did not give satisfaction very long. Question-What are the distinguishing characteristics of the Dodgeville Primitive Methodist Society? They have no different characteristics from any other Primitive Methodist Society. They have distinguishing characteristics from other churches, in their creed and forms of church government. Question-What is the difference in the form of church government between the Dodgeville Primitive Methodist Society and the Dodgeville Plymouth Congregational Church? Answer-The Dodgeville Primitive Methodist Society subscribes to the creed as formulated by, and obeys the regulations of the Western Conference of the primitive Methodist Church. The Dodgeville Plymouth Congregational Church, as I understand it, formulates its own creed and makes its own laws. By the creed, I mean articles of faith or doctrine. Question-What do you mean, ‘obeys the regulations of the conference?’ Answer-Its rules laid down in the discipline. Question-does the conference permit a church to select its own pastor? Question-They permit a church to invite a pastor, but it must be ratified by the conference. Question-Didn’t the Primitive Methodist Church of Mineral Point tell the Conference that met here in Dodgeville that they would select their own pastor? And did not that Church employ Rev. Kent, who was a congregational minister and not a Primitive Methodist Minister as their pastor? Answer-Mineral Point asked permission to supply themselves with a minister and they employed the Rev. Mr. Kent, who at the time was understood to be a Primitive Methodist and not a Congregationalist. I was present at the conference in Dodgeville most of the time. I think it was a fact that the Rev. Mr. Kent was a Congregationalist at the time of the Dodgeville Conference, and asked to be taken back, and they refused. I think he was a delegate at the Ridgeway Conference from Mineral Point. I think that it was at Linden the next year that he was admitted back to the Primitive Methodist Conference. Question-Is there any difference between the forms of worship of the Dodgeville Primitive Methodist Society and the Dodgeville Plymouth Congregational Church? Answer-I have never attended the services of the Dodgeville Plymouth Congregational Church, except to hear the Rev. Titmarsh, before he became a full-fledged Congregationalist. Question-What do you know of any scheme on the part of anyone to change the form of government or religious beliefs of the old Dodgeville Primitive Methodist Society? Answer-There were several of them, including the minister in charge, who had been trying for a year or more to change it into a Congregational Church and induce others to work to that end. I was not in favor of withdrawing from the Conference. I worked against it. I did not state that I would be willing to withdraw if they would wait till after the next conference. At the Society meeting in December 1896, when the question was agitated, among other things, I said this: ‘Brethren don’t withdraw now. You will only create strife and confusion. Wait until after the next Conference, and if you then find Conference in the state you would have us believe, we will all go together. They tried to make us believe that Conference was on the eve of going to pieces, but I did not believe it. Conference had before that time passed the Resolution found on page 11 of the printed proceedings of the Conference held at Mineral Point in May 1896, as follows, to wit: ‘Whereas the report of the Circuits and charges to the general committee during the past year shows, that of a membership of 1730, 986 favor a continuance of our denomination as it is, and 744 favor its dissolution, and Whereas, the general Committee has recommended to this Conference that we listen to the voices of the majority; ‘Therefore, be it resolved that, as a test of their earnestness and fidelity to the connection, we hereby ask of them to confirm their words by their deeds in the coming year, by contributing to the mission fund at least 50 cents per member, for the payment of debts against said fund, and the organization of a new, pure, mission fund, and a liberal support of the other conference funds; that they show loyalty to the ministry by cheerfully and promptly paying them their salaries; that they strictly adhere to the discipline of the Church; and by their labors for God, show that they can and will use our connection for the advancement of God’s glory. Then we will accept it as conclusive that it is the will of God that we should continue as an organization; but if the reports show to the contrary, that they propose to merely exist as in the past, it shall be proof conclusive that the loyalty is only in words and not in acts, and at the next session, this Conference will dissolve its organization. Resolved, that if any charge or circuit shall have decided to withdraw from the connection, we bid them Godspeed, and pray that their new association may bring them to grander opportunities for the advancement of His Kingdom.’ I am unable to say that the reports to the next conference showed that the membership of the Primitive Methodist Churches had not responded to the request contained in that resolution. But before the reports were reached, the resolutions were rescinded. The first resolution was rescinded at Ridgeway. I refer to this found on page 6 of the printed proceedings of 1897, as following, to wit: Moved by Brother J. Bide that the resolution of last conference to dissolve this year as a conference if the fifty cents per member were not forthcoming be rescinded. After some discussion, a standing vote was called for. The motion prevailed.” The church at Hazel Green went out of the conference and came back again. I recall no others, except the church at Dodgeville. Thomas H. Arthur Exhibit A Dodgeville, March 6th, 1849 We the undersigned trustees of the Dodgeville Republican Church, situated on Lot. No. 10 on Main street; being sixty feet n front, in Jabe Wilson’s addition to the Town of Dodgeville, in Iowa County, Wisconsin: That, whereas there is a debt of one hundred and fifty ($150.00) dollars on said church., we hereby relinquish the management of said church, in favor of the stewards of the Wesleyan Methodist Society, on condition that they, stewards, will pay the above named one hundred and fifty ($150.00) to the respective creditors. Should the trustees refund the said one hundred and fifty dollars to the stewards of the Wesleyan Methodist Society, in the case, the said church will return to its former mode of management. Samuel Hosking Joseph Vincent John Hosking Edward Thomas William James Benjamin James James Hendy John Lumley Deposition of GEORGE BUNTING Deposition of GEORGE BUNTING taken before me, September 22nd, 1903 J.J. Hoskins “Deposition of GEORGE BUNTING, a witness, was taken before me at my office in the City of Dodgeville, in said county and state, on the 22nd day of Sept., 1903, commencing at 8:00 am pursuant to the annexed notice, to be used on the part of the defendants in an action pending in the Circuit Court for Iowa County, in the state of Wisconsin, wherein Alice Cape, et al are plaintiffs and Plymouth Congregational Church, et al are defendants.” “The said witness being first duly sworn by me to testify the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, relative to said action, in answer to oral interrogatories pronounced by J.P. Smelker, esq, who appeared for the defendants, (the said deponent being represented by his attorney, C. Spensley) deposed and made answer as follows:” “My name is GEORGE BUNTING. I live in Dodgeville. I have lived here 16 or 17 years. I have been in the vicinity of Dodgeville about 50 years. I am a member of the Dodgeville Primitive Methodist. Society. I remember the time when the church changed to the Congregational Church. It was 4 or 5 years ago, or it might be 6 years. Before that time, I had been a regular attendant upon the meetings and services of the church.” “I did not attend the services at the Plymouth Congregational Church at all after the change. They put me out. I did go once or twice after the change I think. Mr. Kemp preached once, and Mr. Ruge, who is preaching now. I can’t say how long Titmarsh preached after the change. I don’t think I went to hear Titmarsh after the change. I can’t remember whether I did or not.” “I can’t tell whether the services were conducted in the same manner when Mr. Kemp preached as when Titmarsh preached before the change. Oh! Yes! I went to hear this lawyer they call Jenks. He told some stuff. I could not say whether the services were conducted in the same manner when I heard Ruge preach as they were before the change. I expect the form of worship was the same when I heard Kemp and Ruge preach as it was before the change.” Question: Was the doctrine which you heard Mr. Ruge and Kemp preach any different than the doctrine which you had heard Titmarsh preach before the change?” Answer-“I can’t mind it, whether there was any difference or not.” Question-You say you were put out. Who was it? Answer-They locked the door on us. We could not get in. This was about the time of the separation, maybe a little before. This was on a Monday night. Question-What service was to be held in the church Monday night? Answer-We wanted to get a Society meeting to meet. I mean by ‘we’, the Primitive Methodist Society. Question-Who locked the door on you? Answer-I can’t tell. There was a new lock put on, and the old one took off, when we got to the door, we could not get in. Johnnie Johns stood at the door. He was a member of the Primitive Methodist Society before he was turned out. Question-Who was there wanting to get in? Answer-Me and Brother Glanville, Charles George, and I think Frank Hocking. There were more, but I can’t think of their names. Question-How many more were there? Answer-I could not say. Question-About how many? Answer-I don’t know how many. I have no idea how many. It was dark and I could not tell who were there. [Remember, GEORGE was beginning to go blind. He was between 82 and 84 years old at the time of this incident. In his last years, his eyesight failed completely. He is not admitting to this here, just that he ‘couldn’t remember’.] When we could not get in, we then went to Johnston Glanville’s house. I don’t know whether all who were outside the church went to Glanville’s house. Me and Mr. Glanville and his daughters. I think Tom Arthur was there. I could not tell whether Charley George was there. I don’t think Charley George was there, I could not say whether Frank Hocking was there. Question-Were there as many as six of you at Glanville’s house that night? Answer-I don’t know. I can’t say. There may have been more. I could not tell whether it was in the kitchen or the front room that we met in. I can’t think of but one meeting at Glanville’s house on that business. Question-What did you do that night at Glanville’s house? Answer-I can hardly tell what we did now, but we wanted to get into the church to consult what was best to do. I can’t recollect whether we elected trustees or not. Question-Were you present at any time at the house of Glanville’s when Trustees were elected? Answer-Yes. I could not tell the time, not so very long ago, six months or so. Question-What Trustees did you elect at this meeting, 6 months ago? Answer-Mrs. Theobald [his step-daughter, Mrs. Simpson Bunting’s daughter], I think, in Frank Hocking’s place. I think Hocking had left the church. I don’t think we elected Trustees at that first meeting at Glanville’s. I can’t mind the business we did there. [He uses the word ‘mind’ it seems, as a synonym for ‘remember.’] Question-Were you ever excluded from the church at any other time than the Monday night that you have referred to? Answer-No, sir. I could not say whether that meeting at Glanville’s was in the latter part of March, 1897. Perhaps it was. I could not tell. Question-Was that meeting after the change in the church? Answer-It was just about the time of the change. I can’t tell when it was. I never was refused admittance to any of the services of the church after the change. I don’t know that anybody else was refused admission. Question-After the change, and after the incorporation of the Plymouth Congregational Church of Dodgeville, did you attend any of the business meetings of the said church? Answer-No sir. Question-Were you elected a trustee of the Primitive Methodist Church after its incorporation? Answer-No sir. Question-Isn’t it a fact that in March, 1897, you and Johnson Glanville attended a business meeting of the Dodgeville Plymouth Congregational Church, held at the church, at which you were elected trustee? Answer-No sir, never. Question-Were you present at any meeting of the said Plymouth Congregational Church when Johnston Glanville was elected deacon? Answer-I think it was not a Plymouth Congregational Church then. Question-To what time do you refer, when you say ‘then’? Answer-When they called that meeting you are alluding to. Question-Were you present at the meeting when Rev. Kent Carter and Brown were over here to receive the Church into the Congregational Body? Answer-I was. Question-Was not the meeting at which Johnston Glanville was elected Deacon held after the meeting just referred to? Answer-I can’t tell. I was present at some meeting about that when Johnston Glanville was elected Deacon. But it was against his will awfully. He did not want it. He was present at the same meeting, I think. I couldn’t say what he said or did not say, or if he said anything at that time. I was not elected a trustee at the same meeting that I know of, but I was a trustee. We have what we call a Primitive Methodist Society in Dodgeville now. We hold the meetings, one at Rev. Durant’s and one at the City Hall. We hold the prayer meetings and Aid Society at Durant’s and preaching services at the City Hall. Could not say how long ago we began to hold services at the City Hall. Three or four years ago, perhaps. Question-For what length of time after the change, was it that you held no preaching services at all? Answer-I could not tell the time. It might be 12 months, I could not say. It might be longer, it might not. Question-Are the doctrines of the Dodgeville Plymouth Congregational Church any different from the doctrine of the old Primitive Methodist Church? Answer-I know nothing about that. I do not know what the doctrines of the Dodgeville Plymouth Congregational Church are. Question-Do you know what the doctrines of the old Primitive Methodist were? Answer-Yes. To do right and live right, and not cheat nobody. That will do. Question-Were there any other doctrines of the said Dodgeville Plymouth Congregational Church? Answer-I have no more to say. Question-Are the practices of the Dodgeville Plymouth Congregational Church any different from the practices of the old Dodgeville Primitive Methodist church? Answer-My dear man, I know nothing about it. Question-Why was it that you did not attend the preaching services of the Plymouth Congregational Church at Dodgeville? Answer-How could you expect it, when we were put out? Question-Who put you out? What do you mean by that? Answer-I refer to that Monday night when they locked the door on us, and when I was put in jail. We had to give bonds or go in jail. Question-Was that for taking forcible possession of the church in the night time and barricading the door, so as to keep the congregation from holding services there Sunday morning? Answer-I did no such thing. I was not in the church during that Saturday night. I was there on the Sunday morning. A man from Mineral Point was with me in the church Sunday morning. I think Arthur was there when they came to get possession of the church. He was not there when I came in, and I don’t think Frank Hocking was there. I was there about eight o’clock in the morning and I was there when Mr. Mundy climbed in through the back window. I mind that. I can’t mind that the front door was barricaded with a heavy piece of timber, and that it could not be opened, and I think it was for this that me and Frank Hocking and Tom Arthur and the man from Mineral Point was arrested. I don’t know whether the man’s name from Mineral Point was Prideaux or not. I don’t know who that was. Question-Why did you not attend the preaching services of the Dodgeville Plymouth Congregational Church before you were arrested in August 1897? Answer-I can hardly bring my thought to the matter. I didn’t like the proceedings. I didn’t like what they had been doing. I mean what I just told you, they put me out of the church. I don’t like the church government. Question-In what does it differ from the old Primitive Methodist Church of Dodgeville? Answer-The church government is to live right, do right, and cheat nobody, and they don’t do it. Could not tell how many members there are in the present Primitive Methodist Church of Dodgeville. I have no idea. I can give you my name, and my wife as members. Mrs. Chappel, Annie Glanville, Mrs. Theobald and her daughter, Annie, Mrs. Mathew Rogers, Mrs. Cape, Miss Ellen Freeman, Mrs. Jones, Durant and his wife, and Rev. martin and his wife, are members. Brother Arthur and Cutler and their wives are members. Examination by Spensley I am suffering from a bad cold. My head is all of a swim. I have difficulty in collecting my thoughts. Re-examination by Smelker Question? My cold has been coming on for three or four days. It affects my head and body, and you can tell I have a cold in my voice. I have taken no medicine for it. Don’t believe in taking much medicine. Question-When you try, you can collect your thoughts and know what is going on, can you not? Answer-After a while. When my testimony was being read to me, I understood what was being read to me, and I had no corrections to make to the testimony. Question-Was the testimony as read to you true and correct? Answer-I expect it was. Question-Don’t you know that the testimony as read to you was true and correct? Objection to, because the question has been answered before. Objection overruled. Answer-I don’t know. Attest: J. J. Hocking GEORGE BUNTING His x mark File at: http://files.usgwarchives.org/wi/iowa/history/other/iowaseri12gms.txt This file has been created by a form at http://www.genrecords.org/wifiles/ File size: 99.4 Kb